This one?

The Wife:
 
My wife does most, well, nearly all of the cooking in our home, but yet has very little enthusiasm or interest in kitchen cutlery.  I’m always saddened when she just grabs a dullish steak knife to perform some task when a drawer full of very sharp knives is available for her enjoyment.  But alas, despite my best efforts she remains about as interested in knives as is a hungry cat when offered a bowl of straw.
 
I was feeling the need to sharpen an edge, and going through the in-drawer knife block I was delighted to find a blade that didn’t hang on my thumbnail.
 
The Knife:
 
The ever so slightly dulled knife was a 6” Victorinox Fibrox chef’s knife which probably gets the most use in our kitchen. 

   
 
For the price it is an amazingly good blade.  With a blade only a little over 1 mm thick, it is light weight and easy to handle.  When sharpened to 15°, which is factory spec, it cuts extremely well and even with the acute bevel the edge retention is surprisingly excellent.
 
It was reviewed by the PBS TV show America’s Test Kitchen and chosen as the winner when compared to others.  The 8” version is seen frequently in use in the TV program.  They wondered why it performed and held an edge so well so they sent it to a lab for analysis.  They found that it is made of fine grain steel.  I must say that even with a coarse grind the thing takes a great, very sharp edge and keeps it very well too.
 
The Belt:
 
I sharpened it with a single belt.  A brand new 150 grit Cubitron belt.  The Cubitron and Cubitron II belts have become my favorite.  They are extremely sharp, and at least for light duty stuff like cutlery sharpening, last longer without almost any apparent loss of sharpness than any other belt I’ve tried.  Being so sharp, they cut quickly with little pressure and therefore generates very little detectible heat.  If that were not enough, they are a pretty red color which complements my shop décor.  I’m thinking maybe some matching tissue holders to complete the look.  Thanks Mr. Mark for introducing me to them! 

   
 
Sharpening:
 
As I mentioned, the belt was brand new and super sharp so I just tickled the blade with belt.  That’s all it took.  A couple of extremely light strokes on each side formed a tiny burr that was easily removed by just kissing the blade edge to the leather belt on the Kally. 
 
Sharpness at the center of the blade was 135, and near the tip was 140. 
 
The Wife:
 
I walked into the kitchen to find my wife chopping carrots with a dull steak knife!  To get through the carrot required a lot of pressure to begin the cut, and with each cut I heard a whacking sound on the cutting board.  Whack!  Whack!  I gave her the newly sharpened blade and the whacking sound stopped, replaced by the most gently little tap as the Victorinox just melted through.  I watched as she moved on to radishes!  Beautifully controlled thin slices that appeared completely effortless.
 
Here are pics of the edge, the first near the tip, the second in the middle of the blade.  As I mentioned, 140 at the tip and 135 in the middle of the blade.  Nice and sharp and toothy!  Tomatoes, broccoli and onion skins don’t stand a chance.  Gotta love those Cubitron belts.  Looking at those edges it’s easy to imagine how something that sharp and toothy easily breaks through even stuff with a smooth, tough skin.

Tip:
   

Middle:
   

That's all!

this story starts off on dec. 16th while i am working the whole foods complimentary knife sharpening gig.

young navy guys walks up and wants to know if i can move the bevel up about 1/2" or more to thin his knife for better edge.  he says he in in no rush.......i have sharpened some pocket knives before for him, so i take it home and work on it about 40 mins each time, that is 2 times.

it is HARD..... i make no progress hardly so i decide to call my knife making guru buddy in SD......many of you know him well and ask if would consider a small project of this sort.

the rest is HISTORY......before pics......right off the grinder pics and right out of the box in va. pics.

cost for project:............try zero............thats what friends do for friends in 2018.....before and after.

thank you very much mr mark
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right off the grinder
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right out of the box today in va
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We're running this up the flagpole here because we're interested in your input so please, input away.

The premise here is that edge rolling is a major contributor to dull edges and edge longevity (retention).  Edge overheating during the sharpening process is probably one of these contributing factors that we could all agree on but how much of a problem is it? A little, a lot or a whole lot? If one sharpening methodology seems to indicate a very measurable effect on edge rolling does another methodology effectively mitigate it? Of course there are many other contributing factors that could be tested for as well and we won't try to enumerate them all here but, of course, initial sharpness level, steel hardness and blade geometry come to mind readily.

One thing that we have absolute confidence in here is the ability of our instrumentation to measure the effect of edge rolling. We can't tell you, in inches or degrees, how much the edge has rolled but we can measure its effect on edge sharpness with great certainty. But that what's it's all about for all of us here isn't it? How easy or difficult it is to cut through something.

So we propose to build a test apparatus. A test apparatus that will perform one very simple test; how much did an edge roll expressed by it's decrease in sharpness? We propose to measure the sharpness level of a particular location of a prepared edge then lower,very carefully, that edge onto a narrow strip of hardened steel and then measure again to obtain an indication of how much the edge edge rolled as a result of the process. We will be able to add loading (weight) to the process should that prove useful. 

So there you have it! It's a simple test stand to build and if you guys think that it could deliver useful information then we'll build it. We'll test the edges we create and we'll test the edges you create if that's how you want it. If you have thoughts, design or otherwise, we'd like to hear them.  Please keep in mind that we are testing for only (1) one factor with this test instrument, edge rolling. We do not intend to try to define, with this device, how much better (or worse) a toothy edge slices than a polished edge  or any one of a myriad of other questions we'd like to answer. 

   

“Thanks.

I hate your answer.  It's not fair.  Nobody told me I'd ever have to have any talent!  “

Grepper just posted this on another topic. I enjoy Grepper's humor and trust that everyone realizes he does not really hate anyone. This humorous remark does spark a serious topic: It reminds me of musicians with perfect pitch.

Most of us have relative pitch. A few gifted people have perfect pitch. Research indicates that some musical training by age six may be necessary to activate perfect pitch. The rest of us can develop our relative pitch through good training. I have a sense of pitch which belongs in the audience, however, from years of listening to hundreds of piano lessons and classical music, I can tell when a performer is singing off pitch or time.

How does this apply to sharpening? With no false modesty, I do not consider myself a natural sharpening talent. I work mostly with the Tormek. I have become a believer in mastering small basic parts of technique one at a time. I believe that a 3/4” bench chisel can be the great teacher. It has only a single, straight bevel. It is sized to fit well with the machine and jig. It is also sized to be easily observed. Working with just this single tool, you can learn the sound and feel of good (and bad) grinding. you can learn the operation of the machine, from good technique with the water trough to set up and clean up. You can master the truing tool, stone grader, and Anglemaster. You can master coarse and fine grinding as well as the leather honing wheel. You can learn what sharp is and how it looks at various stages. I have around a dozen of these 3/4” chisels, and recommend having three. I recommend the Irwin (Formerly Marples) Blue Chip chisels. They have adequate length, have a proper square back (not radiused by a designer who never sharpened a chisel to look nice), and they are inexpensive. Stay with the one size. Do not buy sets.

My main point is that focused work habits, study and practice can help those of us not blessed with natural talent. 

Thanks, Grepper.

Ken

With the New Year I am starting my mini electric kiln project and would be grateful for your recommendations or even guidance.

For the time being I am calculating how long and how thick heating kanthal wire I need. Preliminary results are, that I need 20 meters of kanthal wire of 1 mm (or 0.04") diameter.

This should support 1600 W input power and max. kiln temperature of some 2000°F. The kiln size is 3x4.5x12". Quite challenging is to calculate the diameter of the heating spiral so, that it can be accommodated in the side walls of the kiln. The heating spiral must be stretched so that its threads do not touch each other.

   

Simultaneously I am considering suitable PID temperature regulator.

Jan

Last week I assessed in-house sharpening methods at a meat factory, and found out you can tell by BESS scores if the edge has lost its temper from overheating during sharpening.

These 2 knives are identical, one sharpened by me and another by the Customer; have been cutting non-stop for 5 hours, and boned 200 pig legs each.
Can you tell by the diagram below, which knife was sharpened wrong? BESS scores are on the vertical axis.

I'm new to this group and new to using the BESS sharpness tester but it really helped out when writing this article for More Woodturning Magazine.  The steels I used were common steels found in the Woodturning groups.   Hope you all enjoy reading it and look forward to the input. 
https://www.morewoodturningmagazine.com/...7d78763e40

Thanks for our moderator Mark Reich -
Mark has lived and worked at Mr. Ed Fowlers Ranch for months on end. http://www.edfowler.com/index.php
Mark has lived and worked with Murray Carter. https://www.cartercutlery.com/
Mark is a friend to all - thank you Mark for your contributions.

Thanks to EdgeOnUp - Mike Brubacher http://edgeonup.com/AboutContact.html

Thanks to Thomas Lofvenmark http://www.edgepal.com/english-5444885
For 2018 better health for you and yours and continued input to this forum.

Thanks to Vadim Kraichuk http://knifegrinders.com.au/09Contact.htm
Vadim made it possible for me to get great edges from my Tormeks

The list could go on and on and on.

Thanks to all

Rupert

Adonstar USB microscope
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Andonstar-50...SweZJaRet2
I wouldn't recommend the Adonstar, I struggle with it, the stand is wobbly.

Because of that I bought another one, twice as expensive, still not happy with the resolution
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/3-5-LCD-500X...SwcUBYSQ4A

Yet have to find a satisfactory one without getting broke. I remember liking Jan's BRESSER microscope that he got as a present from his children I believe.
https://www.bresser.de/en/Microscopes-Ma...m-3-5.html
Jan, are you happy with yours?