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» Forum threads: 412
» Forum posts: 4,749

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Latest Threads
How to prevent the edge o...
Forum: All About Edges
Last Post: SHARPCO
12-07-2019, 12:42 AM
» Replies: 5
» Views: 33
"Wootz"
Forum: Relevant General Discussion
Last Post: Rupert Lucius
11-29-2019, 11:09 AM
» Replies: 10
» Views: 440
**New Record, Sharpest Kn...
Forum: Edge Sharpness Testing
Last Post: grepper
11-28-2019, 04:55 PM
» Replies: 1
» Views: 62
ID75A and PT50 Series
Forum: Edge Sharpness Testing
Last Post: Mike Brubacher
11-25-2019, 05:00 PM
» Replies: 0
» Views: 38
ID75A and PT50 Series
Forum: Edge Sharpness Testing
Last Post: Mike Brubacher
11-25-2019, 05:00 PM
» Replies: 0
» Views: 40
Too dull to shave with?
Forum: Edge Sharpness Testing
Last Post: grepper
11-24-2019, 11:46 PM
» Replies: 4
» Views: 102
Ancient blades - Live up ...
Forum: Relevant General Discussion
Last Post: SteveG
11-16-2019, 02:42 AM
» Replies: 8
» Views: 281
Edge retention in high-en...
Forum: Edge Sharpness Testing
Last Post: KnifeGrinders
11-16-2019, 12:00 AM
» Replies: 0
» Views: 81
Sorry-Forgot a new Partne...
Forum: BESS
Last Post: Mike Brubacher
11-04-2019, 03:49 PM
» Replies: 0
» Views: 101
Burl - but not Ives
Forum: Woodworking Tools
Last Post: Mike Brubacher
10-28-2019, 10:52 AM
» Replies: 8
» Views: 484

 
  How to prevent the edge oxidation?
Posted by: SHARPCO - 12-05-2019, 06:08 AM - Forum: All About Edges - Replies (5)

I think I need something like oil. I've used camellia oil. It's food safe but I found it couldn't prevent edge oxidation well. 

What is the best solution? I'm looking for it can be used on kitchen knives. 

Thank you.

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  **New Record, Sharpest Knife , 4 BESS, Kknives Switzerland.
Posted by: Deadboxhero - 11-28-2019, 01:02 PM - Forum: Edge Sharpness Testing - Replies (1)

Roman Káse from Knives Switzerland
Using Nitrobe77 at 64rc.


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  ID75A and PT50 Series
Posted by: Mike Brubacher - 11-25-2019, 05:00 PM - Forum: Edge Sharpness Testing - No Replies

We get a lot of questions concerning the differences between the ID75A and PT50 Series instruments. In addition to the  ID75A's RS232 communications it's just plain bigger. Here are two units going out today and I took this picture to demonstrate the difference in the packaging sizes.


                                                [attachment=929]

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  ID75A and PT50 Series
Posted by: Mike Brubacher - 11-25-2019, 05:00 PM - Forum: Edge Sharpness Testing - No Replies

We get a lot of questions concerning the differences between the ID75A and PT50 Series instruments. In addition to the  ID75A's RS232 communications it's just plain bigger. Here are two units going out today and I took this picture to demonstrate the difference in the packaging sizes.


                                                    

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  Too dull to shave with?
Posted by: grepper - 11-16-2019, 09:27 PM - Forum: Edge Sharpness Testing - Replies (4)

I use disposable razors because they perform reasonably well, last a month or more each and are incredibly inexpensive.  I use nothing special double bladed ones because for no real reason I think they perform better than single blade models.  I bag of a dozen costs less than $10 and I’m good to go for a year or so.  When they get too dull to use they join billions of others to help fill our landfills with plastic crap that will survive there for the next 400 years or more.

I have probably about average beard consistency.  Not like a wire brush but not peach fuzz either.  If I don’t shave for a day it’s very visible and scratchy. 
 
Today one reached the point where I decided it needed replacing with a new one.  I think it has been in use for more than a month.  It was not horribly dull.  It did not grab, yank or tear hair out but required 3 or 4 passes over the same area to get the job done.  In a pinch it could probably have been used for another couple of weeks but I decided its useful life had passed.  Here is a picture of it.


   
 
I’ve often wondered as to the sharpness when I decide one has reached its demise.  I was guessing it would be 300 or so.  This time curiosity got the better of me and I decided to actually measure the sharpness.   I “disassembled” it and removed the two razor bands using a process that resulted in eliminating any possibility of reassembly.

   
 
The little strips of metal are incredibly wimpy, thin and flexible.  An impressive job of design and engineering to make a razor out of them that performs as well as they do.  To perform the measurement I gripped the metal strip with two needle-nosed pliers and grasped the razor band with the jaws maybe 3/16” apart from each other.  This stabilized the blade between the jaws of the pliers enough to perform the measurement. 
 
I took a total of 3 measurements, two on one blade and one on the other.  I was truly surprised by the results.  As I mentioned I was guessing to see something like 300, but instead the measured sharpness with the PT50-B was:
 
65, 75, 75

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  Edge retention in high-end knives
Posted by: KnifeGrinders - 11-16-2019, 12:00 AM - Forum: Edge Sharpness Testing - No Replies

Edge Retention in High-End Knives

Tests on high-end knives performed by Nathan Stuart – the all-Australian record holder of the sharpest knife in both non-kitchen and kitchen categories.
Formula of Nathan’s record = brains + persistence + quality sharpening equipment + sharpness tester.


The Testing can be watched on the Nathan’s YouTube Channel >>
This test cutting routine consists of 2 cuts across 80 gsm print paper, then 5 more cuts of the 80 gsm print paper, followed by sequence of 2 cuts of twin-core (double-ply) cardboard till the sharpness score goes beyond the forearm shaving range of 160 BESS.
Nathan selected the latter as a cut-off value for his testing, as the high-end knives stay around 200 BESS sharp for too long to be practical to test them further.


Added at the bottom are test data for a Victorinox professional boning knife NSF 6.6603.15, sharpened at 12 dps, to give a reference to the mainstream s/s knives.
Note that Nathan knives are sharpened at 16-17 dps (only the M4 at 13 dps), while I gave the Victorinox the lowest angle possible for this steel, to maximize its performance in the cutting test.


Note that at 200 BESS sharp the high-end knives last and last, unlike the mainstream knives 

[Image: Edge_Retention_High_End.png]
Numbers in the table are BESS measured on PT50B

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  Ancient blades - Live up to the hype?
Posted by: grepper - 11-08-2019, 10:24 PM - Forum: Relevant General Discussion - Replies (8)

I would like to understand the lore out there that a long, long, long time ago swords and other blades were created being endowed with almost mystical qualities of durability and sharpness, far superior than anything that has since been forged.  You know the story.  Steel created from a secret iron ore vein in Outer Mongolia, sharpened with long lost secret sharpening techniques only known to long ago deceased Zen sharpening masters after sprinkling magic Zen dust about the place.
 
Blades so tough they would half an armored knight and a silk scarf falling through the air would cleave upon contact with the edge.
 
Umm…, really? 
 
To be clear, I know basically nothing about, and have done no research on ancient metallurgy, steel or swords.   Being totally clueless, I wonder if all you folks are as suspicious of the hype as I am.  Following is my reasoning and where I suspect the myth comes from.
 
I suspect that most blades made eons ago were utter crap, made from weak steel full of impurities that would perform poorly.  By chance, occasionally some iron of greater purity was found that made a better blade.  These blades became legendary because they were 20% better than the average local crap blades of the time.
 
Every so often some ore was discovered that contained other minerals such as chromium or vanadium, etc., that produced a “super” blade for the time.  These blades became legendary. 
 
Over time humans got better at production methods.  Better smelting and equipment to produce purer, stronger steel.  They discovered that steel could be folded and bashed repeatedly to remove impurities and how adding various minerals would improve quality. 
 
Now metallurgy is very well understood and steel formulations are produced with laboratory precision as though from a cook book.  Steel manufacturers know all about it.  Different minerals and chemicals can be added to steel formulations to produce steels that perform to predetermined specifications and requirements.  Are folks really claiming that any of the ancient blades can outperform modern super steels?  Really?
 
Has anyone tested the Rockwell hardness of these primordial blades?  Did they actually have some super hard blades that they could actually sharpen that didn’t chip? 
 
Then there is the whole sharpening mystique.  While I admit the ancient Zen master sharpeners may have had secret Zen sharpening dust to sprinkle about whilst inwardly droning in meditation “Namu Amida Butsu” and viewing the world through the third eye, I doubt they knew more about sharpening than many BESS Exchange members. 
 
Then there is the fact that these primordial sharpeners were working with stone knives and bear skins.  They didn’t have precision sharpening equipment.  No amazing assortment of belts with even coatings of about any type of abrasive from AO to diamonds in grits from 20 to 5,000 and finer. 
 
So these claims of mystically sharp ancient blades…  What does that even mean?  How sharp were they?  400?  200?  100?  50?  25? 10?   BESS Exchange members know what sharpness means and thanks to EOU can actually measure it. 
 
For whatever reason, knives and sharpening is ensconced in mysticism as though there is some secret to steel and the only way to learn how to sharpen is to spend a lifetime of self-deprivation in a monastery. 
 
Yet the myth of these old blades persists.  What is the RHC of these blades?  Do they chip?  How do they perform in SET tests? (I bet they roll like any other blades or worse). What is the BESS sharpness number?  Maybe I'm full of crap, it seems to me that this is quantifiable and we can dispel the myths.
 
What do you guys think?

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  Sorry-Forgot a new Partner
Posted by: Mike Brubacher - 11-04-2019, 03:49 PM - Forum: BESS - No Replies

We left a new Partner out of our last post and our apologies for that oversight.

                                                

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  "Wootz"
Posted by: Mike Brubacher - 10-31-2019, 10:56 AM - Forum: Relevant General Discussion - Replies (10)

Had one of those "aha" moments recently. Some of you know already that one of our distinguished Exchange members posts in other forums (or at least did so at one time) under the  moniker "Wootz". I've been in contact with some individuals in India recently (Hyderabad, Telejanga specifically) and learned that they claim that their region is the birthplace of Damascus Steel - except they call it "Wootz". Isn't that interesting?

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  More BESS Partners
Posted by: Mike Brubacher - 10-24-2019, 10:28 AM - Forum: BESS - No Replies

This months new BESS Partners. Bess Partners from all over the world continue to gain a "leg-up" on the competition by providing before and after BESS sharpness numbers to their customers. BESS Partners enjoy an advantage in both their service to their customers and their advertising. Best thing is - assuming that you are an edge sharpness testing instrumentation owner and a small commercial knife sharpener - BESS Partnerships are free!

Just email us at mikeb@edgeonup.com and tell us who you are - where you're at - a little about your business - what type of edge testing instrument you own and how you intend to use your BESS Partnership in your business. Make certain that you indicate in your email how your certificate should be titled.


                                                                                                                         

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