07-25-2018, 10:52 AM
Thank you Grepper, the correction has been made to the chart. We think that your analogy of one egg versus two may just turn out to be correct in this case. Let's think about this a little differently though. What if you didn't place an automobile on the egg but rather a 1 LB. weight and that 1 LB. weight crushed the egg as well. Now place two eggs adjacent each other so that both bear the force of the 1 LB. weight equally. Let's say that, now, the two eggs, in tandem, support the 1 LB. weight without crushing. Now we have better established the parameters of the experiment and can begin playing with one egg and two egg combinations while more precisely varying the force impinging on them and, hence, come up with a fairly precise answer to the question "How much force is required to crush the average egg?" If we continue to use automobiles as our minimum force, however, we are not likely to discover the answer to the egg/force question with any precision.
We wonder if our 150 gram force applied to the edge is not, in effect, an automobile to a sharpened edge apex. We use a mass of 150 grams because it seems a very minimal and reasonable amount when compared to the forces that are applied to a knife edge in actual use and... it still seems reasonable. In fact though, perhaps if we were to use a 15 gram force, as opposed to 150 grams, then we might begin seeing significant differences between various HRC hardness numbers. It's just food for thought and we have no intention of pursuing this experiment but it does make us wonder if we are trying to repair a swiss watch with a sledgehammer. Don't misunderstand Grepper, your point is well taken. If the real world dictates that it is eggs and automobiles then there is little point in experimenting with eggs and feathers.
Jan we believe that your understanding is the same as ours. The characteristics of the edge apex remain, substantially, unchanged through the rolling process. The roll itself presents a very substantial change in geometry, almost certainly several microns wide at dimension "A" in the following drawing.
We know that a common knife cutting surface several microns wide would be a near useless implement so, whether cutting up pork loins, carrots or test media, the original edge apex must still be performing the work. This is something that we would like to understand better.
One other point here Jan. In a thread somewhere on the Exchange you expressed the possibility that "foil effect" might be the explanation behind the apparent ductility of sharpened edges. This was while we were advancing the possibility that the ductility of edges might be due to plasticized steel. We (EOU) have proven our theory invalid with these experiments so the only current viable theory left today is yours. Until such time as you are overthrown or abdicate, you are the King.
We wonder if our 150 gram force applied to the edge is not, in effect, an automobile to a sharpened edge apex. We use a mass of 150 grams because it seems a very minimal and reasonable amount when compared to the forces that are applied to a knife edge in actual use and... it still seems reasonable. In fact though, perhaps if we were to use a 15 gram force, as opposed to 150 grams, then we might begin seeing significant differences between various HRC hardness numbers. It's just food for thought and we have no intention of pursuing this experiment but it does make us wonder if we are trying to repair a swiss watch with a sledgehammer. Don't misunderstand Grepper, your point is well taken. If the real world dictates that it is eggs and automobiles then there is little point in experimenting with eggs and feathers.
Jan we believe that your understanding is the same as ours. The characteristics of the edge apex remain, substantially, unchanged through the rolling process. The roll itself presents a very substantial change in geometry, almost certainly several microns wide at dimension "A" in the following drawing.
We know that a common knife cutting surface several microns wide would be a near useless implement so, whether cutting up pork loins, carrots or test media, the original edge apex must still be performing the work. This is something that we would like to understand better.
One other point here Jan. In a thread somewhere on the Exchange you expressed the possibility that "foil effect" might be the explanation behind the apparent ductility of sharpened edges. This was while we were advancing the possibility that the ductility of edges might be due to plasticized steel. We (EOU) have proven our theory invalid with these experiments so the only current viable theory left today is yours. Until such time as you are overthrown or abdicate, you are the King.